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Buu Arc SSJ4 Goku; How far does he get?
Topic Started: Jan 13 2018, 02:50 PM (1,031 Views)
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superperfectnerd
Jan 24 2018, 04:40 AM
Why didn't Old Kai just do the ritual on Goku then instead of pulling out his tail if ssj4 is a potential unlock?

Goku << Goku ssj4 (full potential unlock) << 'Ultimate' Goku (Old Kai's beyond full potential unlock)
Episode 32
Time: 8m25s
Context: Goku and Kibitoshin want to know why they need a pair of pliers
Elder Kaioshin: "Getting Goku's tail to grow out was the purpose of all the training up until now."
Goku: "My tail?"
Elder Kaioshin: "That is the only way to call up Goku's idle power."

Episode 33
Time: around 9m20s
Context: Goku's tail has been pulled out
Elder Kaioshin: "Now Goku's dormant power should appear!"

Episode 33
Time: 15m35s
Context: Elder Kaioshin and the others are watching Goku from the glass ball
Kibitoshin: "Grand Kaioshin-sama, what's the matter with Goku-san? Wasn't his dormant power supposed to have been awakened?"
Elder Kaioshin: "That's what was supposed to happen..."
Note: In the dub, Kibitoshin just wonders if they pulled Goku's tail out too far and that's why he's doing so poorly.

Episode 33
Time: 20m25s
Context: Great Ape Goku stands before Baby
Narrator: "At last, Goku's dormant power has been awakened! Having transformed into a golden Great Ape, will Goku be able to defeat Baby?"


Seems like dormant power to me.
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superperfectnerd
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They always say things like 'dormant power' upon awakening a new transformation, that's just semantics.
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El Macho
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Goku would clean easily
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superperfectnerd
Jan 24 2018, 11:50 AM
They always say things like 'dormant power' upon awakening a new transformation, that's just semantics.
It's really not. It's clear that's exactly what they're talking about, not some static multiplier or one time deal. None of the other transformations were treated that way.
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Goddess Ultimecia
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YusukeReborn
Jan 24 2018, 03:40 AM
Goddess Ultimecia
Jan 13 2018, 03:34 PM
Yeah, depending on if you take guidebooks or official guides as gospel. SSJ3 has the same function as SSJ4 when it comes to unlocking dormant power. So all Goku would gain from it is it's faaaaar more sustainable than SSJ3. Problem being. Ultimate Gohan is faaaar more powerful than SSJ3 Goku, with or without strain.
I don't buy that really.

Otherwise SSJ4 Goku in GT would have been crushed by Bebi Vegeta.
Oh I'm not saying that I agree with it, just there are some that abide by side material like that.
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孫悟空

He isn't getting past Gohan since Goku's potential isn't as great as his.
Edited by Son-Goku, Jan 24 2018, 09:55 PM.
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YusukeReborn
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Goddess Ultimecia
Jan 24 2018, 09:53 PM
YusukeReborn
Jan 24 2018, 03:40 AM
Goddess Ultimecia
Jan 13 2018, 03:34 PM
Yeah, depending on if you take guidebooks or official guides as gospel. SSJ3 has the same function as SSJ4 when it comes to unlocking dormant power. So all Goku would gain from it is it's faaaaar more sustainable than SSJ3. Problem being. Ultimate Gohan is faaaar more powerful than SSJ3 Goku, with or without strain.
I don't buy that really.

Otherwise SSJ4 Goku in GT would have been crushed by Bebi Vegeta.
Oh I'm not saying that I agree with it, just there are some that abide by side material like that.
SSJ3 is only stated to be a X4 increase.
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superperfectnerd
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Pyrus
Jan 24 2018, 08:37 PM
superperfectnerd
Jan 24 2018, 11:50 AM
They always say things like 'dormant power' upon awakening a new transformation, that's just semantics.
It's really not. It's clear that's exactly what they're talking about, not some static multiplier or one time deal. None of the other transformations were treated that way.
Goku's power lies dormant because he hasn't got the form. Ssj forms aren't power they don't really have, it's hidden saiyan power lying 'dormant' inside them. When Goku first went ssj he released 'dormant' power. Nowhere in those lines does it say "this will unlock Goku's full potential" and even if it is implying that, the ritual takes a person beyond their full potential, so 'ultimate' Goku should be superior to ssj4 Goku, meaning this whole tail pulling activity is inferior and I don't understand why Old kai didn't do the ritual. If he's talking specifically about a way to unlock Goku's hidden power, then he really should remember the dance he's famous for and was allegedly sealed away for than can do just that and more, instead of choosing to pull out his tail.
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They didn't have time for the dance is the only reasoning I have. Training was faster and would lead to a desirable result.
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StrenuousSpider
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Pyrus
Jan 26 2018, 07:08 PM
They didn't have time for the dance is the only reasoning I have. Training was faster and would lead to a desirable result.
Its like what 24 hours for the ritual. What kind of training makes you stronger then your strongest self and byond in 24 hours. Even if they did not have the time the time chamber would give them that time and training time.
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The ritual is about a day, but the point of Goku's training was to get his tail back in order to achieve Super Saiyan 4, which only Elder Kaioshin knew about. To him, that form would've been more efficient than waiting a day. I think they only had a limited amount of time for some reason. I can't remember why exactly.
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StrenuousSpider
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Pyrus
Jan 26 2018, 11:45 PM
The ritual is about a day, but the point of Goku's training was to get his tail back in order to achieve Super Saiyan 4, which only Elder Kaioshin knew about. To him, that form would've been more efficient than waiting a day. I think they only had a limited amount of time for some reason. I can't remember why exactly.
Well i mean if elder think its better its better. But going off files the ritual is better. But i suppose plot is why they did not do it. Like in super lol.
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